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author/date sort problem
Author: D Price    Posted: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 15:10:00 -0800
Hi Can anyone help with this problem - Refman tech support have said not, and that there is no known workaround, but maybe someone out there knows different. I am just finalising my PhD thesis, and when I generate the bibliography I have two problems (using a Harvard-style style). First, within the text citations, when I am citing more than one work by the same author, it is putting the authors in alphabetical order but not in date order - the date order is random. In the generated bibliography I have the same problem - the authors are in order, but the dates are random. I am drawing on a number of databases for the bibliography (about ten). The software is recognising that several references are by the same author, but not getting the dates within that sorted. I am using my own style, based on the American Psychological Association, but I have now tried to generate this bibliography with a number of different output styles that come with Refman, and I always have the same problem. Any help would be much appreciated as I am otherwise facing very substantial amendments by hand - and indeed I cannot even work out a way to resolve the in-text citation problem manually, since you can't change the order (it re-sets when you print). Many thanks Debbie ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System.

Re: author/date sort problem
Author: Lee Lim    Posted: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 13:25:00 -0800
Dear Debbie, My experience is with RM9.5. When you activate "Generate Bibligraphy" a window for "Bibliography Setup" pops up. The 3rd and 4th fields if the Reference List tab allow you to choose "Reference List Order" and "In-Text Citation Order". Perhaps you would like to delete the last generated reference list and re-activate it again and set to the reference list order to "Citation order" before you hit OK. It will list the reference in order of your in-text citation. Regards, Chong Lee Lim Department of Neurology Westmead Hospital Westmead NSW 2145 Australia Tel: +612 9845 6834 Fax:+612 9635 6684 >>> D.Price "d.price" 9/07/2005 9:10:00 am >>> Hi Can anyone help with this problem - Refman tech support have said not, and that there is no known workaround, but maybe someone out there knows different. I am just finalising my PhD thesis, and when I generate the bibliography I have two problems (using a Harvard-style style). First, within the text citations, when I am citing more than one work by the same author, it is putting the authors in alphabetical order but not in date order - the date order is random. In the generated bibliography I have the same problem - the authors are in order, but the dates are random. I am drawing on a number of databases for the bibliography (about ten). The software is recognising that several references are by the same author, but not getting the dates within that sorted. I am using my own style, based on the American Psychological Association, but I have now tried to generate this bibliography with a number of different output styles that come with Refman, and I always have the same problem. Any help would be much appreciated as I am otherwise facing very substantial amendments by hand - and indeed I cannot even work out a way to resolve the in-text citation problem manually, since you can't change the order (it re-sets when you print). Many thanks Debbie ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. __________________________________________________________________ This electronic message and any attachments may be confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this message would you please delete the message and any attachments and advise the sender. Western Sydney Area Health Services (WSAHS) uses virus scanning software but excludes any liability for viruses contained in any email or attachment. This email may contain privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressees named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this email is prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please notify WSAHS immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of WSAHS. ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

RE: author/date sort problem
Author: Dr Richard Mailman    Posted: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 13:20:00 -0800
I think there was a workaround posted last year to this problem on ordering within the citations -- maybe someone has it handy. If you are going to manually change things in the document, you should first save the document under a new name, highlight the whole text of the document in Word, and then press CTRL-SHIFT-F9. This turns ALL of the fields in the document into pure text, and will prevent you from losing you manual changes when you print. If you also highlight your Table of Contents, you'll have to recreate it. HOWEVER, the document is now foreign to Refman (hence the reason to do this with a copy). Richard B. Mailman, Ph.D. Professor of Psychiatry, Pharmacology, Neurology, and Medicinal Chemistry CB#7160, 7001C NC Neurosciences Hospital University of North Carolina School of Medicine Chapel Hill NC 27599-7160 USA "richard_mailman" Voice 919.966.2484; FAX 919-966-9604; Mobile 919.260.7976 -----Original Message----- From: "listmaster" "mailto:listmaster" On Behalf Of "D.Price??????????????????? Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 7:10 PM To: "RIS-List" Subject: <RefMan> author/date sort problem Hi Can anyone help with this problem - Refman tech support have said not, and that there is no known workaround, but maybe someone out there knows different. I am just finalising my PhD thesis, and when I generate the bibliography I have two problems (using a Harvard-style style). First, within the text citations, when I am citing more than one work by the same author, it is putting the authors in alphabetical order but not in date order - the date order is random. In the generated bibliography I have the same problem - the authors are in order, but the dates are random. I am drawing on a number of databases for the bibliography (about ten). The software is recognising that several references are by the same author, but not getting the dates within that sorted. I am using my own style, based on the American Psychological Association, but I have now tried to generate this bibliography with a number of different output styles that come with Refman, and I always have the same problem. Any help would be much appreciated as I am otherwise facing very substantial amendments by hand - and indeed I cannot even work out a way to resolve the in-text citation problem manually, since you can't change the order (it re-sets when you print). Many thanks Debbie ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

RE: author/date sort problem
Author: Mahesh    Posted: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 13:10:00 -0800
One solution could be to export these references to a xcel or something like that. Next, sort bu date and author in excel. For this order, create a new field (say) sortid. Save the sorted results. Next import back in ref man, with the new sorted field. I haven't tried this, but may potentially work... We have the same problem, that we are trying to address. Good luck! Mahesh -----Original Message----- From: "listmaster" "mailto:listmaster" On Behalf Of D.Price "d.price" Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 6:10 PM To: "RIS-List" Subject: <RefMan> author/date sort problem Hi Can anyone help with this problem - Refman tech support have said not, and that there is no known workaround, but maybe someone out there knows different. I am just finalising my PhD thesis, and when I generate the bibliography I have two problems (using a Harvard-style style). First, within the text citations, when I am citing more than one work by the same author, it is putting the authors in alphabetical order but not in date order - the date order is random. In the generated bibliography I have the same problem - the authors are in order, but the dates are random. I am drawing on a number of databases for the bibliography (about ten). The software is recognising that several references are by the same author, but not getting the dates within that sorted. I am using my own style, based on the American Psychological Association, but I have now tried to generate this bibliography with a number of different output styles that come with Refman, and I always have the same problem. Any help would be much appreciated as I am otherwise facing very substantial amendments by hand - and indeed I cannot even work out a way to resolve the in-text citation problem manually, since you can't change the order (it re-sets when you print). Many thanks Debbie ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

RE: author/date sort problem
Author: D Price    Posted: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 14:30:00 -0800
Thanks for this suggestion - of course the problem was that I did not enter the references in any particular order as I did not anticipate this problem so this is a mammoth task, potentially, as I would have to go through each citation and manually re-order them first. I have now posted a different suggested workaround for this bug to the list - if it fails then I will certainly try this, Many thanks Debbie -----Original Message----- From: "listmaster" "mailto:listmaster" On Behalf Of "Lee.Lim??????????????????? Sent: 15 July 2005 22:25 To: "RIS-List" Subject: Re: <RefMan> author/date sort problem Dear Debbie, My experience is with RM9.5. When you activate "Generate Bibligraphy" a window for "Bibliography Setup" pops up. The 3rd and 4th fields if the Reference List tab allow you to choose "Reference List Order" and "In-Text Citation Order". Perhaps you would like to delete the last generated reference list and re-activate it again and set to the reference list order to "Citation order" before you hit OK. It will list the reference in order of your in-text citation. Regards, Chong Lee Lim Department of Neurology Westmead Hospital Westmead NSW 2145 Australia Tel: +612 9845 6834 Fax:+612 9635 6684 >>> D.Price "d.price" 9/07/2005 9:10:00 am >>> Hi Can anyone help with this problem - Refman tech support have said not, and that there is no known workaround, but maybe someone out there knows different. I am just finalising my PhD thesis, and when I generate the bibliography I have two problems (using a Harvard-style style). First, within the text citations, when I am citing more than one work by the same author, it is putting the authors in alphabetical order but not in date order - the date order is random. In the generated bibliography I have the same problem - the authors are in order, but the dates are random. I am drawing on a number of databases for the bibliography (about ten). The software is recognising that several references are by the same author, but not getting the dates within that sorted. I am using my own style, based on the American Psychological Association, but I have now tried to generate this bibliography with a number of different output styles that come with Refman, and I always have the same problem. Any help would be much appreciated as I am otherwise facing very substantial amendments by hand - and indeed I cannot even work out a way to resolve the in-text citation problem manually, since you can't change the order (it re-sets when you print). Many thanks Debbie ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. __________________________________________________________________ This electronic message and any attachments may be confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this message would you please delete the message and any attachments and advise the sender. Western Sydney Area Health Services (WSAHS) uses virus scanning software but excludes any liability for viruses contained in any email or attachment. This email may contain privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressees named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this email is prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please notify WSAHS immediately. Any views expressed in this email are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority states them to be the views of WSAHS. ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

RE: author/date sort problem
Author: D Price    Posted: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 14:25:00 -0800
Hi Richard Yes - this was one of my early attempts to solve the problem manually, but unfortunately it also removes all my _formatting_ for my thesis (I don't know why) and so is only a solution for the bibliography, which I can print discretely - it doesn't help with the in-text citations. However, I have just posted a workaround to this bug which involves deleting author first names from the database, apparently. Thanks, Debbie -----Original Message----- From: "listmaster" "mailto:listmaster" On Behalf Of "Dr.Richard.Mailma"@med.unc.edu] Sent: 15 July 2005 22:20 To: "RIS-List" Subject: RE: <RefMan> author/date sort problem I think there was a workaround posted last year to this problem on ordering within the citations -- maybe someone has it handy. If you are going to manually change things in the document, you should first save the document under a new name, highlight the whole text of the document in Word, and then press CTRL-SHIFT-F9. This turns ALL of the fields in the document into pure text, and will prevent you from losing you manual changes when you print. If you also highlight your Table of Contents, you'll have to recreate it. HOWEVER, the document is now foreign to Refman (hence the reason to do this with a copy). Richard B. Mailman, Ph.D. Professor of Psychiatry, Pharmacology, Neurology, and Medicinal Chemistry CB#7160, 7001C NC Neurosciences Hospital University of North Carolina School of Medicine Chapel Hill NC 27599-7160 USA "richard_mailman" Voice 919.966.2484; FAX 919-966-9604; Mobile 919.260.7976 -----Original Message----- From: "listmaster" "mailto:listmaster" On Behalf Of "D.Price??????????????????? Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 7:10 PM To: "RIS-List" Subject: <RefMan> author/date sort problem Hi Can anyone help with this problem - Refman tech support have said not, and that there is no known workaround, but maybe someone out there knows different. I am just finalising my PhD thesis, and when I generate the bibliography I have two problems (using a Harvard-style style). First, within the text citations, when I am citing more than one work by the same author, it is putting the authors in alphabetical order but not in date order - the date order is random. In the generated bibliography I have the same problem - the authors are in order, but the dates are random. I am drawing on a number of databases for the bibliography (about ten). The software is recognising that several references are by the same author, but not getting the dates within that sorted. I am using my own style, based on the American Psychological Association, but I have now tried to generate this bibliography with a number of different output styles that come with Refman, and I always have the same problem. Any help would be much appreciated as I am otherwise facing very substantial amendments by hand - and indeed I cannot even work out a way to resolve the in-text citation problem manually, since you can't change the order (it re-sets when you print). Many thanks Debbie ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

RE: author/date sort problem
Author: D Price    Posted: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 14:25:00 -0800
Hi Mahesh I have been told that this is a bug which can be dealt with by the following rather tiresome workaround, which I haven't yet had time to try: The bug is triggered by having entered first names as well as surnames in the author filed, such as 'Smith, Peter' instead of 'Smith,P.' Apparently if I use the global edit function (if you don't know how to use this, I can send you instructions) to edit all of my author names in this way (i.e. lose the first name information) then the author/date sort will work properly, including in the in-text citations. I haven't tried this yet, as I have over 200 authors in about 12 databases, and it will take me a few hours to edit them all, I think. I have been taking special care to enter all the first names for years now... If this doesn't work, then another workaround suggested to me for the in-text citations was to manually order them in the order that I want them in the text, and then choose 'citation order' for the format for the in-text citations. For the bibliography, if I remove the 'field codes' (with the 'remove field codes button) then I get the bibliography generated as ordinary text, and I can then manually re-sort but this is obviously time consuming, although not too bad, because it is only an issue where I have more than one citation from the same author. Otherwise, I think your excel solution might work, and if all else fails I will try this. Many thanks, Debbie -----Original Message----- From: "listmaster" "mailto:listmaster" On Behalf Of "Deshpande" Sent: 15 July 2005 22:10 To: "RIS-List" Subject: RE: <RefMan> author/date sort problem One solution could be to export these references to a xcel or something like that. Next, sort bu date and author in excel. For this order, create a new field (say) sortid. Save the sorted results. Next import back in ref man, with the new sorted field. I haven't tried this, but may potentially work... We have the same problem, that we are trying to address. Good luck! Mahesh -----Original Message----- From: "listmaster" "mailto:listmaster" On Behalf Of D.Price "d.price" Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 6:10 PM To: "RIS-List" Subject: <RefMan> author/date sort problem Hi Can anyone help with this problem - Refman tech support have said not, and that there is no known workaround, but maybe someone out there knows different. I am just finalising my PhD thesis, and when I generate the bibliography I have two problems (using a Harvard-style style). First, within the text citations, when I am citing more than one work by the same author, it is putting the authors in alphabetical order but not in date order - the date order is random. In the generated bibliography I have the same problem - the authors are in order, but the dates are random. I am drawing on a number of databases for the bibliography (about ten). The software is recognising that several references are by the same author, but not getting the dates within that sorted. I am using my own style, based on the American Psychological Association, but I have now tried to generate this bibliography with a number of different output styles that come with Refman, and I always have the same problem. Any help would be much appreciated as I am otherwise facing very substantial amendments by hand - and indeed I cannot even work out a way to resolve the in-text citation problem manually, since you can't change the order (it re-sets when you print). Many thanks Debbie ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

AW: author/date sort problem
Author: Gerhard Englert    Posted: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 14:35:00 -0800
Hi Debbie, I faced the same problem and got no answer either. If you plan to amend your work, do it only ***after*** you ended any work related to RM. Remove all field codes (I use RM10-11) to make it a pure and clean text. Then only you can be sure RM does not destroy your labour again. This way is is as much labour, but at least straight forward and only a one time and never again job. sorry for not having a better solution Gerhard > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- > Von: "listmaster" > "mailto:listmaster" Auftrag von > "Deshpande" > Gesendet: Freitag, 15. Juli 2005 23:10 > An: "RIS-List" > Betreff: RE: <RefMan> author/date sort problem > > > > One solution could be to export these references to a xcel or > something like that. > Next, sort bu date and author in excel. For this order, create a new > field (say) sortid. Save the sorted results. > Next import back in ref man, with the new sorted field. > > I haven't tried this, but may potentially work... > We have the same problem, that we are trying to address. > > Good luck! > Mahesh > > -----Original Message----- > From: "listmaster" > "mailto:listmaster" On Behalf Of > D.Price "d.price" > Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 6:10 PM > To: "RIS-List" > Subject: <RefMan> author/date sort problem > > > Hi > Can anyone help with this problem - Refman tech support have said not, > and that there is no known workaround, but maybe someone out there > knows different. > I am just finalising my PhD thesis, and when I generate the > bibliography I have two problems (using a Harvard-style style). > First, within the text citations, when I am citing more than one work > by the same author, it is putting the authors in alphabetical order > but not in date order - the date order is random. > In the generated bibliography I have the same problem - the authors > are in order, but the dates are random. I am drawing on a number of > databases for the bibliography (about ten). The software is > recognising that several references are by the same author, but not > getting the dates within that sorted. > I am using my own style, based on the American Psychological > Association, but I have now tried to generate this bibliography with a > number of different output styles that come with Refman, and I always > have the same problem. Any help would be much appreciated as I am > otherwise facing very substantial amendments by hand - and indeed I > cannot even work out a way to resolve the in-text citation problem > manually, since you can't change the order (it re-sets when you print). > Many thanks Debbie > > ______________________________________________________________________ > __ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs > Email Security System. > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > __ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs > Email Security System. > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

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