List Archives >  EndNote List Archive >  Archive by date >  This Month By Date >  This Month By Topic

Endnote as research repository

Search email archive for  

Endnote as research repository
Author:    Posted: Tue, 11 Jan 2005 17:40:47 -0500
I'm a new endnote user so I apologize if I am missing the obvious, if so please set me straight. But it seems to me that endnote is missing the boat on a richer functionality set. When we do research don't we want to capture quotations from the source document along with the bibliographic markers? I tend to read a lot when I research and I'd like to have a way to capture actual text passages, key ideas, my thoughts on how this passage connects to concepts from other sources, etc. Then I'd like to be able to search through all of this with keywords and sometimes full text search on whatever quotation or passage I've scanned or typed into the knowledgebase. We can use the endnote 'notes' field for this as long as we are willing to live with a one-to-one relationship of source to notes, shouldn't there be a one-to-many relationship of source to multiple passages for an entity relationship? I think there is a kludge. We can just populate the notes field in the source record with 1 to n quotations, then we can load the source keyword field with all of the keywords for all the quotations in the notes field for that record. Maybe this will be fine. On the other hand packages like personal brain (www.thebrain.com) give you the capability to dynamically create a knowledgebase with nodes and multiple relationships. But personal brain doesn't have all the Z39.50 ease of retrieval and great formating and word processor interfaces that endnote has. So am I the only one who wants a knowledgebase that will house quotations from the source (markable with keywords and uniquely searchable) as well as the source biblio data itself, or is there some solution in endnote that is staring me in the face? stranger in a strange land, jim ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

Re: Endnote as research repository
Author:    Posted: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:34:44 -0500
Jim, What do you mean by "one-to-many relationship of source to multiple passages"? Endnotes does a pretty good job of coming up with all the sources that relate to an idea, so long as I'm good about using standardized keywords. Sometimes my keywords are marvelously opaque. "Robbie's Rules" and "The Kid" represent whole lines of thought to me, but when I search on them, I DO get all the sources that related, at some point in my reading, along with all the notes I made as I read it. I generally use the notes field for other people's comments on the same text as well, and I simply code the notes so that I can distinguish quotations, commentary and my own musings. dale wrote: > I'm a new endnote user so I apologize if I am missing the obvious, if so please set me straight. But it seems to me that endnote is missing the boat on a richer functionality set. > > When we do research don't we want to capture quotations from the source document along with the bibliographic markers? I tend to read a lot when I research and I'd like to have a way to capture actual text passages, key ideas, my thoughts on how this passage connects to concepts from other sources, etc. Then I'd like to be able to search through all of this with keywords and sometimes full text search on whatever quotation or passage I've scanned or typed into the knowledgebase. > > We can use the endnote 'notes' field for this as long as we are willing to live with a one-to-one relationship of source to notes, shouldn't there be a one-to-many relationship of source to multiple passages for an entity relationship? > > I think there is a kludge. We can just populate the notes field in the source record with 1 to n quotations, then we can load the source keyword field with all of the keywords for all the quotations in the notes field for that record. Maybe this will be fine. > > On the other hand packages like personal brain (www.thebrain.com) give you the capability to dynamically create a knowledgebase with nodes and multiple relationships. But personal brain doesn't have all the Z39.50 ease of retrieval and great formating and word processor interfaces that endnote has. > > So am I the only one who wants a knowledgebase that will house quotations from the source (markable with keywords and uniquely searchable) as well as the source biblio data itself, or is there some solution in endnote that is staring me in the face? > > stranger in a strange land, > > jim > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email > Security System. > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

Endnote as research repository
Author:    Posted: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 14:28:58 -0500
Here is an exchange on the "Endnote as research repository" message I sent to the procite listserv. Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2005 17:40:47 -0500 (EST) From: /> Subject: Endnote as research repository I'm a new endnote user so I apologize if I am missing the obvious, if so please set me straight. But it seems to me that endnote is missing the boat on a richer functionality set. When we do research don't we want to capture quotations from the source document along with the bibliographic markers? I tend to read a lot when I research and I'd like to have a way to capture actual text passages, key ideas, my thoughts on how this passage connects to concepts from other sources, etc. Then I'd like to be able to search through all of this with keywords and sometimes full text search on whatever quotation or passage I've scanned or typed into the knowledgebase. We can use the endnote 'notes' field for this as long as we are willing to live with a one-to-one relationship of source to notes, shouldn't there be a one-to-many relationship of source to multiple passages for an entity relationship? I think there is a kludge. We can just populate the notes field in the source record with 1 to n quotations, then we can load the source keyword field with all of the keywords for all the quotations in the notes field for that record. Maybe this will be fine. On the other hand packages like personal brain (www.thebrain.com) give you the capability to dynamically create a knowledgebase with nodes and multiple relationships. But personal brain doesn't have all the Z39.50 ease of retrieval and great formating and word processor interfaces that endnote has. So am I the only one who wants a knowledgebase that will house quotations from the source (markable with keywords and uniquely searchable) as well as the source biblio data itself, or is there some solution in endnote that is staring me in the face? stranger in a strange land, jim >-----Original Message----- >From: Mingfang Li /> >Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2005 9:53 AM >To: Jim Franzen >Subject: Endnote > >Jim, > >Your posting on Endnote user list reads very interesting. As you >continue to discover and develop ways to use Endnote or Endnote and >other program combination I would like to see new posts detailing your >innovations. > >I've been struggling with the same thing but so far I have not found >any good solution. For now I am utilizing Microsoft Onenote to keep my >readings notes and misc. research related notes (often with pointers to >key references). Onenote does have some unique advantages (such as >freeform, word processor like, and tags for better management). > >Regards. > >Mingfang >------ >Mingfang Li, Ph.D. >Professor of Management >California State University Northridge >Northridge, CA 91330-8376 USA >+1 (818) 677-2421 (O) >+1 (818) 677-6265 (Fax) >www.csun.edu/~mli/ ---- Original message ---- >Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 10:27:18 -0700 >From: "Jim Franzen" /> >Subject: RE: Endnote >To: /> > >Mingfang, > >I looked at Onenote when I was trying a tablet PC, but I couldn't get >the voice, handwriting, and OCR input advantages of the tablet to work >reliably enough. Perhaps I should look at Onenote on a desktop. I >found that the personal brain package (www.thebrain.com) worked well >for me. It seems to have similar functionality to what you like in Onenote. > >I have looked at some other packages that seem to be more >quotation-centric. Scholar's Aid (www.scholarsaid.com) has the entity >relationship design I want, but it is not nearly as efficient as >Endnote in internet database and library catalog search and retrieval. > >We can stay with Endnote and use the user-defined fields along with the >notes field for quotations or key concepts for each source. That may >be the best compromise. My other alternative is to use Personal Brain >along with Endnote as a knowledgebase suite. I'll experiment with what >data entity types should reside in which package and let you know. > >By the way, should I be posting our correspondence on the Endnote list >somehow? I am new to this list and not sure of the etiquette or >process. > >Regards, > >Jim > > ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

Re: Endnote as research repository
Author:    Posted: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 13:22:23 -0500
> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 14:28:58 -0500 (EST) > From: /> > Subject: Endnote as research repository > > Here is an exchange on the "Endnote as research repository" message I > sent to the procite listserv. Hi Jim, Thanks for posting this - I've been using Endnote for about a year now, and have also been wrestling with this very issue, particularly now that I am beginning research on my thesis. Unfortunately I don't have any other real solutions other than those you have discussed already. Perhaps the best solution would be for ISI to allow a one to many relationship between a reference and notes in a future version. Another idea I was toying with was using Endnote for searching for/importing/entering references, and generating bibiliographies/footnotes etc, while regularly exporting the Endnote database into another format, either an intermediate one such as XML or Excel, or straight to another database such as MySQL, Oracle, Access, whatever, depending on size. Then I would try to create the proper note relationship in the other database and use it for actual notetaking/searching for notes etc. I don't even know if this is possible with Endnote, and it would be a royal pain to say the least, as at mimimum it would require regular syncing of the second database to make sure it has all the references. It also requires knowledge of SQL and entity relationships etc. Just a thought at this point and I haven't had the time to properly investigate it - like you, I thought that this was what this sort of software was supposed to be able to do! Cheers, Martin Hubley Doctoral Candidate University of Ottawa -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.6.11 - Release Date: 12/01/2005 ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

Re: Endnote as research repository
Author:    Posted: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 13:24:25 -0500
Jim, About a year ago I was obsessed with a similar concern: I wanted to be able to link all cited references including their relevant quotes, to the citing article. This involved a similar "one to many" relationship. I asked ISI and they said it can't be done in Endnote. So I started playing around with the new Filemaker Pro 7. It has infinite file size, infinite field size, huge related links capacity, with GUI visual representations of relationships. In my fantasy, I thought we could go back and forth from Filemaker to Endnote in order to use Endnote's word-processing-linked features. But I guess FMP 7 is still too new. I wrote to them about a relatively primitive capacity which I need for this "solution", but I never heard back: In my Filemaker "solution", each Table [what used to be a File in earlier versions of FMP] would represent a book or article; the Records would be pages of the book; one Field would contain all the text or pdf of that page; other Global Fields would be the title, author, etc; and the Relationships would be all the citations to other books/articles. I can't move forward on this idea, however, without being able to duplicate tables. In addition, I will want to have hundreds of tables in each "solution", thus I will need ways to find the one I want, besides sorting the list view and then pulling down to approximately the right place. I will definitely need to quickly find individual tables in the "relationships" view. I'd like to be able to search for individual tables, groups of tables, etc. on a number of criteria, in the relationship view as well as the list view. Any hope of these capacities? Anyway, these are all still good ideas; someone somewhere will make it possible. Tina At 5:40 PM -0500 1/11/05, wrote: I'm a new endnote user so I apologize if I am missing the obvious, if so please set me straight. But it seems to me that endnote is missing the boat on a richer functionality set. When we do research don't we want to capture quotations from the source document along with the bibliographic markers? I tend to read a lot when I research and I'd like to have a way to capture actual text passages, key ideas, my thoughts on how this passage connects to concepts from other sources, etc. Then I'd like to be able to search through all of this with keywords and sometimes full text search on whatever quotation or passage I've scanned or typed into the knowledgebase. We can use the endnote 'notes' field for this as long as we are willing to live with a one-to-one relationship of source to notes, shouldn't there be a one-to-many relationship of source to multiple passages for an entity relationship? I think there is a kludge. We can just populate the notes field in the source record with 1 to n quotations, then we can load the source keyword field with all of the keywords for all the quotations in the notes field for that record. Maybe this will be fine. On the other hand packages like personal brain (www.thebrain.com) give you the capability to dynamically create a knowledgebase with nodes and multiple relationships. But personal brain doesn't have all the Z39.50 ease of retrieval and great formating and word processor interfaces that endnote has. So am I the only one who wants a knowledgebase that will house quotations from the source (markable with keywords and uniquely searchable) as well as the source biblio data itself, or is there some solution in endnote that is staring me in the face? stranger in a strange land, jim »@«*´`*»@ ¸¸.·´¯`*´`*»@«*´`*»@«*´`*»@« Tina Kimmel, MSW, MPH PhD Program, UC Berkeley School of Social Welfare ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

Endnote as research repository - results of limited pilot
Author:    Posted: Wed, 19 Jan 2005 14:25:34 -0500
Thanks for the many replies I received to my original query. I've been looking at a lot of software over the break but now the semester begins again. I've worked with trial versions of Endnote, Procite, RefManager, Biblioscape, NoteLens, Scholar's Aid, and other software packages. Endnote does the best job of Z39.50 retrieval of full bibliographic data and formatting that data for inclusion in your MS Word documents. But Endnote is a source-centric application; it handles citation identifiers but not the content of the citation. Many of us work around quotations, key passages from a source, or concepts or notes that are not attached to a article or book source. I need an application that will capture both types of these snippets, provide easy data entry, allow categorization and retrieval by keyword and subject, and house the citation identifiers that connect these short passages to their source. Endnote is not designed for this purpose. Scholar's Aid and Knoesis both offer software that provide this functionality. After entering a test suite of data into both packages, I've decided to use Knoesis index card lite www.knoesis.com for tracking all my quotations, notes, my own papers, etc. It is quick and easy to use, and it is inexpensive. It allows me to enter many notecards for passages or notes from any one source. I simply enter a short citation in the source record in Knoesis, just enough so that I can identify the source for a later Endnote search. When I write something later I'll use Endnote for the actual citations and bibliography, but only for the sources I actually use in a paper. Endnote will let me retrieve full bibliographical data through Z39.50. So most of my time will be spent in Knoesis, and I'll use Endnote for the final touches on papers. After running a pilot on this combination of software I believe it will be the best total solution, at least for my particular work needs. Thanks again for all the replies, I hope our thread is of some value to future queries to this listserv. Jim ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________

Previous by date: EndNote 8 - should we upgrade?, 
Next by date: Re: endnote-interest-digest V1 #1710, 
Previous thread: RTF document scan, 
Next thread: Re: endnote-interest-digest V1 #1699, Schock Michael